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From: (C.C. Jordan)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation.military
Subject: CBD: The Ghost Of Ormoc Bay
Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 06:10:55 GMT

On Fri, 29 May 1998 03:01:15 GMT, (C.C. Jordan)

>On Thu, 28 May 1998 09:32:41 -0400, Stephen Harding
><> wrote:
>>CDB100620 wrote:
>>I don't know what sort of a fighter pilot you were CDB,
>>but you're one hell of a writer!
>He was one hell of a fighter pilot too. 6 victories, three of them,
>I think, flying a P-40N prior to his squadron transitioning to the
>P-38. At least, in a photograph I have seen of CDB and his P-40,
>there appears 3 rising suns stenciled on the port side just below
>the cockpit.
>From what I know of this humble and unassuming gentleman,
>he was the sort of pilot that everyone wanted flying on their wing.
>Highly skilled and utterly dependable. They knew, without a doubt,
>come hell or high water, their tail was covered.
>CDB has a great story to tell, and a great talent for telling it.
>If he writes a book, I for one, will be first on line to buy it.

A brief follow up on CDB.

By now we all know that CDB is a very humble man. Not once, in
a single post, do I recall him ever talking about his accomplishments.
As he writes his book on his experiences during the war, we can be sure
that CBD will minimize his exploits. Therefore, I will take the opportunity
to "blow his horn" just a little.

CDB flew with one of the most famous Fighter Groups of the war, the 49th.
His squadron was equiped with P-40s thru August of 1944. Despite being
shackled to what was essentially an obsolete fighter, CDB's squadron (the 7th)
managed to dispatch 114 Japanese aircraft prior to transitioning to the
P-38 in September 1944.

Let's go off on a tangent for a moment. Robert DeHaven ("Big Bad Bob"
as CDB has called him) gained 10 of his 14 victories flying the P-40. Had
the 7th FS been equiped with P-38s as long as the 9th FS, how many kills
would DeHaven have attained? I am convinced that he would have exceeded
his 14 official victories. By the way, DeHaven may have shot down 15. In a
dispute with another pilot where both claimed the same Japanese fighter,
DeHaven agreed to settle the argument by a coin toss. DeHaven lost. However,
he remained convinced that he had actually destroyed the aircraft.

I have stated that CDB obtained 3 of his six victories flying the P-40N.
What I did not mention was that CDB tended to shoot down the Japanese
in bunches. On January 23, 1944. CDB gunned down a pair of Ki-43 Oscars.
He led his element on a head on pass at the oncoming fighters, sending one
down. He quickly horsed his P-40 around and nailed a second fighter with
a wide angle deflection shot. These were his 2nd and 3rd victories.

CDB's last 3 kills came in one of the more incredible air engagements of the
Pacific war. Having been advanced to Flight Leader, on November 1, 1944,
CDB led three other P-38s on a patrol in the area of Ormoc Bay. CDB spotted
an Oscar well below and led his flight down in a diving attack. As he chased
after the Oscar, the other three pilots in his flight lost sight of him in some
clouds. Very quickly CDB realized that he had flown right into a very large
group of Zeros. Alone, and unsure if he could escape by running, CBD
elected to take on the whole crowd. And take them on he did ! Grossly
outnumbered, with Zeros coming from every direction and angle, CDB ripped
into the Japanese. For what has been described as "a furious 10 minutes"
CBD threw his Lightning around the sky, blasting first one zero and then
another out of the sky. The fight spiralled down towards a Japanese anchorage
in the bay. CDB's P-38 had been hit several times by the Zeros, but not
seriously enough to end the onesided furball. CDB clobbered yet another Zero,
it crashing into a mangrove swamp. That made it 3 down. Still, there
were an awful lot of "Jap" fighters, and the fight had gone down as low as it
could go.

CDB's evasive maneuvering forced him to fly directly over the
Japanese anchorage at low level. Anti-aircraft fire erupted from the ships.
CDB's lightning was quickly shot to pieces by the accurate flak. Finally,
he was forced to bail out of his shattered P-38. Nonetheless, the Zeros
didn't get him. Certainly, they were grateful the flak had allowed them to
let go of this tiger's tail !

Minutes later, CDB landed in the bay, smack in the middle of the Japanese
convoy. Wounded, he found his liferaft was holed and useless. Moreover, only
half of his lifevest would hold air. Hiding under a cluster of floating coconuts
that providentially floated by, CDB escaped detection by both enemy ships
and aircraft which apparently searched for him. Finally, after sunset, Filipino
guerrillas paddled out and fished him from the sea. Over the next 14 days, CDB
was smuggled north until, on November 15th, he was picked up by a Navy PT
Boat and returned to his squadron (I'm sure the chapter of CBD's book dealing
with his escape and return will be amazing reading). Welcomed back to the
squadron, where he was now called "the ghost of Ormoc Bay", CBD was
handed a set of furlough orders for a well deserved rest.

By the way, CBD's flight did not abandon him. They were a bit busy themselves.
One pilot had engine trouble and another waxed an Oscar and damaged a second
one. Arriving too late to help him out, the last they saw of CDB, he was
decending in his parachute.

I dug up this story from serveral utterly reliable sources. I won't list them
here, as this would allow everyone to discover CDB's actual name.
Besides, the information already provided by CDB and Erik Shilling
is more than enough for any ambitious individual to determine who
CDB really is. I really haven't provided any additional clues here. So,
If ya wanna know, ya gotta do your own research.

I sincerely hope that CDB is not embarressed by my overt "bragging on him".
Because, I think that CBD, now enjoying his "golden years", should be able,
without being self-consious, to enjoy a little of the attention he so rightly
earned and deserves. Believing that he would never write in detail of
his Ormoc Bay fight, his humility would never allow it, I took this small
liberty so that everyone on this newsgroup would have a better understanding
of this man who was and is a remarkable fighter pilot and gifted writer.
Personally, I view CDB, and men like him, as national treasures, to be valued,
to be listened to and to be learned from.

I can hardly wait for his book.

Best regards to all,
C.C. Jordan

"Passion and prejudice govern the world; only
 under the name of reason".
                             John Wesley

From: (C.C. Jordan)
Subject: It is time for CDB to come clean.
Date: 03 Jun 1998
Newsgroups: rec.aviation.military

Those of you who read this newsgroup on a regular basis have
come to recognize and enjoy the postings of CDB100620.
You would also have noticed that I have been, along with
Erik Shilling, his biggest cheerleader. CDB's knowledge and
writing skills are very highly regarded.

However, the time has come for CDB to drop the veil and
announce who he really is. Why? Read on.........

Some of us thought that we knew his identity. He has confirmed
that to myself and others via private e-mail.

Yet, it turns out that he isn't who he claims to be. How ironic a twist.
A man, who does not wish to reveal his name, isn't the person who's
name he has be concealing.

But hold on, it gets better........

Those of us who have written CDB in private were convinced that he
was Elliott Dent of the 7th Fighter Squadron, 49th Fighter Group.
Dent was the only pilot in the 7th with 6 confirmed kills. CDB signed
his e-mail "E.D." I began my messages to him with "Dear Elliott".
I was never corrected and certainly led to believe that I was, indeed,
writing to Mr. Dent.

Now here's the caveat........

Elliott Dent died on August 28th, 1993.

There's no mistaking it, the Social Security Administration lists his death.
They require a certfied Death Certificate.
Furthermore, yesterday, I spent several hours on the telephone with some
of Elliott's friends and associates who confirmed his passing.
William Pascalis, personal friend of Elliott and author of "Protect & Avenge:
The 49th Fighter Group in World War II" and is the 49th FG association
historian as well, generously spent 2 hours discussing Mr. Dent and the 49th
despite being sickened by treatment for cancer (keep him in your prayers, those
of you who do such). Mr. Pascalis confirmed Elliott's passing. So did Bill
Schultz, treasurer of the 49th Association. So did Jerry Holtwick, President
of the 49th Association. The America Fighter Aces Association lists Dent on it's
Honor Roll of Deceased Aces. Special thanks to Tim Savage who tipped
me off. Without Tim's help we would still believe that CDB was Mr. Dent.

This information was e-mailed to those whom I knew had contact with and
believed CDB to be Mr. Dent, so that they would have time to digest this
turn of events.

I attempted, both last evening and again this morning, to contact Elliott's son
and namesake, without success. I will keep trying, however, because
he has the right to know that someone is impersonating his father.

I have given the idea of exposing this deception some thought and even
though I consulted with some people for advice, I have elected not to wait for
that advice and post the facts. This has gone far enough.

So the question remains: Who is CDB100620?
Well, a search of dejanews shows that a person or persons using the name(s)
Les. S., Les Summerfield and Keith Pennington have all posted to various
usenet newsgroups under the user name CDB100620 (there may be others,
I didn't read evey post).

Certainly CDB is extremely well versed in Dent's history as well as the P-38 and
the 49th in general. Either this is a brilliant hoax, or Heaven is on-line using
AOL. I don't mind so much being a fool of in this instance. Elliott Dent was
hell of a fighter pilot and a genuine hero.

So, how about it CDB, who are you, and why the elaborate deception?

It is time to come clean. An explanation may enable you to retain some
credibility. Disappearing or denying without proof positive (fat chance)
will result in no one taking you seriously again. Not here, at least.

We've all called your bet, it's time to show your cards.

Regards to everyone
C.C. Jordan

"Passion and prejudice govern the world; only
 under the name of reason".
                             John Wesley

From: (C.C. Jordan)
Subject: Re: Who is CDB???  (Was: AVG Flying Tigers)
Date: 05 Jun 1998
Newsgroups: rec.aviation.military

On Fri, 05 Jun 1998 16:41:38 -0400, Stephen Harding
<> wrote:

>C.C. Jordan wrote:
>> By now of course, everyone should be aware that CDB is not whom we were
>> led to believe. Elliott Dent was a hell of a fighter pilot. Unfortunately, he
>Has CDB ever claimed he was Dent?

Yes. In e-mail. He signed his message with "E.D." I addressed him as Elliott or
Mr. Dent and he never corrected me. A lie of omission is still a lie.

>I don't believe he's claimed to be anyone
>except a member of ??? FG.  (Remember he replied to someone questioning his
>credentials once and gave an impressive list of awards and his fighter
>squadron or group?).  Can't he simply be someone other than Dent?

He obviouly is someone else besides Dent. The question is, why did
he impersonate Dent?

>I personally am not [yet] concerned, since I never read his posts as being
>anyone.  I was merely impressed with his apparent knowledge of SWPA and
>P-38/P-40/P-39.  Even the simple one or two line post about how easy the 38
>was to handle in response to someones post on bad low speed characteristics
>(???) seemed to come from someone who really experienced the behavior.
>Most, of all, even if he is in fact a 13 year old on the computer playing
>games, he's one heck of a writer!

Agreed !

>Since he chooses not to reveal his
>identity, I'm not trying to figure out who he is.  I understand the
>curiousity factor, but until there is some more definitive reason to doubt
>his WWII vet status, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt...for now.

There is every reason to doubt anything he writes. He's a proven imposter
for crying out load ! That is beyond a doubt. Perhaps he should organize
rec.aviation.military.fiction and post there. My goodness Steve, if you would
let a convicted liar off that easy, you likely voted for Clinton too. <grin>
CDB dishonors Dent's memory with such a deception (not to mention
betraying the trust of several members of this group).

>BTW, did anyone other than me get the feeling the "You've convinced me!..."
>post about writing a book was a bit out of character?  I also got undertones
>of a "goodbye" from that message!  Funny the impressions one can get from
>printed words!

Yeah, I got that feeling too. The truth was about to be exposed.

C.C. Jordan

"Passion and prejudice govern the world; only
 under the name of reason".
                             John Wesley
Planes and Pilots of WWII

From: (C.C. Jordan)
Subject: Re: Who is CDB???  (Was: AVG Flying Tigers)
Date: 07 Jun 1998
Newsgroups: rec.aviation.military

On Sun, 07 Jun 1998 12:00:31 -0400, Stephen Harding
<> wrote:

>C.C. Jordan wrote:
>> On Fri, 05 Jun 1998 16:41:38 -0400, Stephen Harding
>> <> wrote:
>> >Has CDB ever claimed he was Dent?
>> Yes. In e-mail. He signed his message with "E.D." I addressed him as
>> Elliott or Mr. Dent and he never corrected me. A lie of omission is
>> still a lie.
>OK, that changes things a bit, although I'm still willing to give him the
>benefit of some doubt.  Since I never thought of him as anyone more than
>a Vet who'd "been there", I'm not as shocked about this as perhaps you
>are having corresponded directly with him.  I recieved one email from him
>WRT my "impossible" ME-109E shooting down bombers over Italy in 1944ish
>post. He replied that he believed it was possible and suggested perhaps
>it was an Italian or other non-LW Emil that did the deed.  A very short
>and logical post.  No apparent attempt to be anyone other than someone
>offering an explanation to an event.  Nearly all posts from him that I
>recall were that way.  No posturing whatsoever.
>> There is every reason to doubt anything he writes. He's a proven imposter
>> for crying out load ! That is beyond a doubt. Perhaps he should organize
>> rec.aviation.military.fiction and post there. My goodness Steve, if you would
>> let a convicted liar off that easy, you likely voted for Clinton too. <grin>
>> CDB dishonors Dent's memory with such a deception (not to mention
>> betraying the trust of several members of this group).
>There's certainly much to what you're saying.  Any future post by CDB
>will be more closely scrutinized and analyzed.  However, this is the
>net!!! For all we really know, Art Kramer is 13 years old having received
>access to a computer for the first time a couple years ago from Mom and
>Dad!  We suspect this is untrue since the content of his posts don't lead
>anyone to believe otherwise.
>One should gain credibility from the content of your postings, not who
>you are, although who you are *will* give you instant credibility (at
>least for a while).  Perhaps CDB is Dent's son?  The only assumption I
>ever made WRT CDB's posts was that "100620" was a birth date!
>In the meantime, I now know who Dent was!  If CDB is some imposter, too
>bad he chose that route.  If posting as "Son of Dent" we'd still be as
>thrilled with the posts as if they had been from Dent himself!

Regarding Elliott Dent III being the author; It certainly is possible that
this is the case. Still, why not identify himself?

Like most people here, I simply took his postings at face value, assuming
the writer was Dent. I failed to pay much attention to errors in details because
I, once again making an assuption, figured that Dent's memory might be a bit
vague after 55 years. My biggest error was not doing the proper look into Dent's
background, which I normally do.

A quick review of CDB's "Lindbergh" post reveals a few "errors in details" that
now take on a greater significance.

Lindbergh spent the vast majority of his time with the 475th FG. While the 475th
and the 49th were both located at Biak in June and July, 1944, the 7th FS was
still flying P-40N aircraft. Only the 9th FS were equiped with P-38's. There
would be little reason for Lindbergh to visit the 7th. Perhaps Dent and DeHaven
hiked on over to the 475th to visit Lindbergh. It's possible. That part about
Dent's dog being a Border Collie is strange. Pedigree dogs were just a bit rare
on Biak Island. CDB, however, posting to another newsgroup mentions owning
and training Border Collies. Undoubtably, CDB inserted the "dog" for effect and
used what he is familiar with. I will be contacting DeHaven next week to get a
little background on Lindbergh's contact with the 7th FS. This may also shed a
little light on our mysterious CDB.

Interestingly enough, CDB did his disappearing act about the time I posted my
"Ghost of Ormoc Bay" story. Perhaps, he determined that anyone researching
Dent's background that deep was very close to discovering his deception.
In that respect, he was right. Tim Savage, guessing the story was about Dent,
discovered that the AFAA had Dent listed as deceased and inquired if I was
writing about the same "Dent". More than a little concerned, I dug into Dent's
history, and we all know the result.

Hopefully, CDB will have the guts to admit his little ruse, and everyone, myself
included, will certainly forgive him his transgression. Then we can all get back
to enjoying his outstanding posts. Especially if he can provide some evidence
that he actually "there".

C.C. Jordan

"Passion and prejudice govern the world; only
 under the name of reason".
                             John Wesley
Planes and Pilots of WWII

From: (C.C. Jordan)
Newsgroups: rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: CDB (Was: Re: What is the weakness of Zero?)
Date: 31 Jan 1999 16:11:20 GMT

On Sat, 30 Jan 1999 19:24:47 -0500, df <> wrote:

>x-no-archive: yes
>> Dan, if he were honest about his background everybody would have
>> welcomed him here.
>Actually, everybody did welcome him here. CDB was showered with
>praise (by me among many others) for the clarity and beauty of
>his writing. You guys kept asking him to write a book! (I didn't
>go that far. Too many book writers out there as it is! But I did
>post one of his recollections on the front page of my website.)
>As for honesty:
>Why don't you look through Deja News and find a post by CDB in
>which he wasn't honest about his background?

Dan, you have an unusual concept of honesty. Any post, wherein
CDB having indicated that he was Elliott Dent, either in private e-mail
or the public forum, is fundamentally dishonest.

>The only person who
>found him dishonest was C.C., and that as I recall was in private
>correspondence between the two,

That's not accurate Dan. I did not find him dishonest. I was informed
by a third party who had found him (Dent) to be dead. See below.

>with C.C. asking the leading
>question, are you xxxxx? and CDB foolishly saying, yeah, xxxxx,
>that's me. He never made that claim on the ng, to the best of my

Here is some of the e-mail which I received from CDB:

Received: from
	by (IMOv14.1) id CQTJa02232
	for <>; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 00:03:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: CDB100620 <>
Message-ID: <>
Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 00:03:22 EDT
Mime-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: Thank you for your response
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Casablanca - Windows sub 170


Thanks for the kind words re my ramblings.  I use my son-in-law's AOL account,
and he advised me not to write my real name in newsgroups because there were
so many crazies out there that it would not be wise.  Now I've sort of grown
to like the "Who was that masked man?" aspect of posting anonymously.
Incidentally, Erik overinflated my biography when he said I was in the PI on
Dec. 7, 1941.   Nope.  And glad of it, too.
Speaking of Erik, I wish he would post more about his knowledge and
experience, such as his description of attacking Japanese bombers.  Very
Most vets don't post, or do so only a few times.  Bob Vrilakas, who was with
the 1FG in the MTO posted a few times then dropped out.  The pilot of an A-20
of the 3AG based at Dobodura, New Guinea, posted a couple of times, then
dropped out.  I corresponded with him, and he had a lot of interesting
stories, but didn't care to put them in the newsgroup.  The B-17 guys rarely
say anything.
I was not interested in discussing the war until recently.  During the war, I
was too busy doing my job and keeping my fingers crossed to pay much attention
to anything except what was right in front of me.  After the war, all I wanted
to do was forget it and get on with things.  But recently, I've been able to
look back objectively at the war.
Incidentally, I agree with those who say vets aren't the last word on
everything about the war.  Was corresponding with a fellow who had served with
the 35FG and he was telling me a lot of interesting things about what that
unit did, but he insisted that the Oscar was an "Army Zero" and that the P-39
had been designed as a ground attack plane.  Wrong on both counts.  (And I
don't think he would have been happy if some college kid had checked a book
and corrected him about it in public.  That may be why vets less feisty than
Art and Erik don't stick around long.  They post a factual error and get
stomped, so they say the hell with it.)  But during the war I think we were
told that the Oscar was the Japanese Army's version of the Zero. And I think
it was commonly believed that the P-39 was intended to be a ground attack
plane--otherwise how explain its poor altitude performance and that weird
Before I forget, your posts are among the handful that I actively look for and
read with interest (let's see, Art, Erik, Shapiro, Scott, Ford, Gustin,
Lundstrom, yours, and that's about it)"

Keep 'em flying!


"Hi, Corey!

Hope you had a good holiday.

Thanks for the invitation to join your web site.  Believe it or not, you are
the third person who has extended such an invitation.  One was George McDowell
of Boeing and the other was a gentleman who has a web site called Zeno's
Drive-In.  I turned them down and I think I will have to decline your
invitation as well, much as I appreciate it.  The main reason is that my posts
to r.a.m. are pretty much fired from the hip, with no eye to them having any
sort of permanence.
I've gotten so much interest from my posts, however, including from a
publisher, that I have decided to write for publication, retrieving the better
posts and reworking them for print.  If I have any success at this, I will owe
it to folks such as you, who have encouraged me more than you can know."



Additionally, I received the following e-mail from active members of this
newsgroup, some of who have asked not to be identified. Why?
Because, I suspect they were embarrassed at being taken in.
Or, they believe that private e-mail is, indeed private.
Me, I was just angry.


I thought it may be of interest WRT CDB. I had email conversations with him a
few years ago, and he stated that he was the son-in-law of Elliot Dent.

Hope this is of some assistance.
Dennis Jensen

Mr. Jordan


In April of 1997 I inquired in Rec.aviation.military about finding a
copy of Boot's Blesse's "No Guts No Glory", and I received an email
reply from a (CDB100620) on 7 April 1997 that was

-Elliot Dent
-7FS 49FG (a long time ago)

(Senders name withheld by request)

There are several others. However, I was asked not to post them publically.

But I do have your e-mail on the topic, which due to your unkind comments,
I do not hesitate to post publically.

Message-Id: <>
X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16)
Date: Wed, 03 Jun 1998 10:35:05
To: "C.C. Jordan" <>
From: Dan Ford <>
Subject: Re: CDB is not Elliott Dent
In-Reply-To: <>
References: <>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

"Wow, C.C., you are one hell of a journalist."

"Ben Schapiro and I have long had a private email correspondence speculating
about CDB; most recently he sent me the post about CDB's war record--200
plus combat missions etc. I wrote back that I was amazed, that I had CDB
pegged as a combat information officer or other non-flying officer in the
SW Pacific. Despite what Erik long ago wrote ("sure seems funny writing to
a number" :) about his being the only person on RAM who sounded as though
he knew what he was talking about, I always thought his posts were too
clinical and impersonal to be the work of a fighter pilot."

"And to think I was just about ready to pull the plug on RAM! This one will
keep me glued to the screen."

                    - Dan     (

So, what happened Dan, why the change of heart concerning CDB?

>Indeed, we only have C.C.'s word on this, at least as I remember
>it. The exchange didn't take place on the newsgroup, and CBD
>vanished forthwith ... as far as we know :)

Hopefully, the above refresher will clearly show that there exists a
great deal more evidence than just "C.C.'s word on this". Furthermore,
if everyone who received e-mail from CDB, signed Elliott Dent, posted
the messages, we would be swamped with postings.

I have already explained how I came to uncover CDB's deception.
Tim Savage was working on the AFAA database and discovered that
Dent was listed on the Honor Role of deceased aces. Tim tipped me off.
I did some simple research which proved the AFAA record as correct.

>Maybe he surfaced again as Cxxxx.

I believe that CDB100620 and ceullers51 are one in the same.

>Maybe Cxxxx, CDB, and C.C. are all one and the same
>third-letter-of-the-alphabet leg-puller.

I would have no difficulty proving otherwise. How about you?
In all seriousness Dan, what is your motive for decrying the exposure
of posters who pose as someone whom they are not? Do I detect
a breakdown of time honored jounalistic ethics? I hope not.

My regards,
C.C. Jordan

The Planes and Pilots of WWII online magazine
A member of the WWII Web-ring.
Honor and remember the WWII veterans.

"In reality, there exists only fact and fiction. Opinions result from
a lack of the former and a reliance on the latter."

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