From: makinkid@aol.comment (MakinKid)
Newsgroups: soc.history.war.world-war-ii
Subject: Re: Banzai Attack or 'Gem Breaking' charge
Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 23:48:00 GMT

Casita wrote:


>>Uh, do you suppose you can provide a reference for cannibalisation of US
>>pilots in Japan?
>
>Uh, your wish is my command,  Mr Moderator,  Sir.
>Hope you post this. <smile>

<Confirming quote snipped>

Cannibalism and vivisection of allied flyers by the Japanese is quite well
documented.  Kyushu Imperial University officials, for example, have
acknowledged vivisecting eight B-29 crewmen in experiments carried out on May
17, 23, 29 and June 3, 1945.

The experiments were arranged by the Western Japan Military Command and Prof.
Fukujiroh Ishiyama, director of external medicine at the university.

In one experiment, Ishiyama extracted an American PoW's lungs and placed them
in a surgical pan.  He made an incision in the lung artery and allowed blood to
flow into the chest cavity, killing the man.  In another experiment, Ishiyama
removed a prisoner's stomach, then cut five ribs and held a large artery near
the heart to determine how long he could stop the blood flow before the victim
died.  In a third, another Japanese doctor made four openings in a prisoner's
skull and inserted a knife into the brain to see what the reaction would be.
The prisoner died.

(from Ienaga, 1968, citing a Japanese publication, The Degradation of Wartime
Medicine:  the Complete Story on Human Vivisection by Hirako Goichi)




Makin

Subject: Lying about atomic bombing and Japanese surrender
From: erikavg@ix.netcom.com(Erik Shilling)
Date: Jul 29 1996
Newsgroups: alt.war

This is about the dumbest argument started on the group.  For those
bleeding hearts, I wonder how they would have had us fight a war
that had been started by a ruthless no holds bared enemy.  

What method could be used to win a war except by killing as many of
the enemy as possible, and of course with a minimum loss on
ourselves.

I would like to hear from Gary Mathews, or anyone who think we
should not have dropped the bomb, would please answer the
following.

Forget how many Japanese lives would or wouldn't have been saved by
dropping the Atomic Bomb.  Lets look at it from our side.

How many Americans would you have been willing to sacrifice to save
just one Japanese life, and especially if it was your own?

Turn this question around.  How many Japanese would you be willing
to kill to save one American life.

As for myself. . . Every damn one of them.

Lets put it this way.  Would you be willing to kill ten, twenty,
thirty, forty, one hundred Japanese to save one American?  

Assume you were alone manning a machine gun position, when a couple
hundred Bushido nuts screaming Banzai were charging your position. 
Would you stop firing after you had killed 10 of the fanatical
suicidal maniacs, saying to yourself you had killed enough?  If not
10?  How many would you kill before you surrendered, or would you
even bother to count the dead, and kill them all.

How about 100 Americans?  If you said you would be willing to kill
100 Japanese as in the above, then that would mean you were willing
to kill a total of 10,000 Japanese.  

How about saving 30,000 Americans.  The number of our soldiers lost
taking Iwojima I believe?  At this ratio, that would mean killing
three million Japanese.

But suppose you had said only 10.  That would still mean that you
were willing to kill 300,000 Japanese. . . Right

Just where my liberal friend would you be willing to draw the line. 
I am quite confident that to save your own precious skin you
wouldn't stop until they either stopped charging or they
surrendered, or all dead.

I don't know the number of Japanese who were killed in the war they
started in 1937, but for argument sake lets assume 2,000,000
Japanese.

If we had the capability to kill one million Japanese with one bomb
at the beginning of the War.  Would it not have been quite likely
that the Japanese would have surrender right from the start. 
Saving the other million Japanese as well as the untold millions
who were killed by the Japanese?
 
From one who has faced the fanatical Jap, and has been shot at.
You have my answer.

Erik Shilling
-- 
Erik Shilling		Author; Destiny: A Flying Tiger's 
Flight Leader              Rendezvous With Fate.
3rd Squadron AVG
Flying Tigers

Subject: Re: Lying about atomic bombing & Japan's Surrender
From: erikavg@IX.NETCOM.COM (Erik Shilling)
Date: Aug 05 1996
Newsgroups: soc.history.war.world-War-Ii

In article <4t5dgd$sha@gazette.bcm.tmc.edu>,
Erik Shilling <erikavg@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>
>>Turn this question around.  How many Japanese would you be
>>willing to kill to save one American life.
>>
>>As for myself. . . Every damn one of them.
snip

In the above, I failed to say every damn one, "if necessary," or
until they surrender, which ever came first.  How many had to be
killed to stop the war would depend entirely up to the Japanese. 
They started the war.  Pearl Harbor.  REMEMBER. 

ronkanen@cc.helsinki.fi (Osmo Ronkanen) wrote:

>I hope you are joking here. Your comment sounds the most
>disgusting I have heard ever in any newsgroup. 
snip

I am dead serious.
You are damn right I would have done anything possible to have
stopped the brutal carnage wrought upon innocent civilians

It may be disgusting to you, but it was heart breaking for me to
watch a friend, with his face half blown away, racked with pain and
dying as he drowned in his own blood.  Where in the hell would you
put a tourniquet. Around his neck?  No doctor or medic available. 
He happened to be a Flying Tiger mechanic by the name of Fauth,
caught in a Japanese air raid at Magwee, Burma.  

Also I hardly think that you have ever seen your best friend, a
pilot who was also with the Flying Tigers, bleed to death because
both legs were blown off.  I have, and his name was Ben Foshee. 
Again no medic could get to him.  I hardly thing a tourniquet
around his torso would have helped.  

The Japanese had bombed the city of Paoshan which was of NO
Military importance, killing innocent civilians.  Have you ever
seen street gutters run red with blood, because thousands of
Chinese had been killed.  I have.

Disgusting, NO.  Heart breaking you're damn right.  Sickening, Hell
Yes.


It is estimated the Japanese killed millions and a lot more than
half were civilians. Possibly only one fifth of those killed by the
Japanese were soldiers.  The Japanese kill approximately 5 times as
many civilians as they did soldiers, and revelled in their butchery.
Therefore let me put it another way, which may allow you a better
understand my statement, and where I'm coming from. 
 
Of the millions of civilians, half of these were either women or
children.  all innocent victims of the Imperial Japanese Army.  How
many civilians would you have let the Japanese kill before you
would kill one Japanese civilian.  

Again turning this around, would you let them kill 10 civilians
before you would kill just Japanese civilian if this would help
stop the human carnage carried out by the Japanese troops?

I think a lot of people forget that the entire Japanese Empire had
either taken every nation around them, or was at war with the rest. 
The original demands by the Americans was that the Japanese get out
of all occupied countries.  They refused and the bombing of Pearl
Harbor was their answer.
  
much snipped
>There are cases where one must risk one's own troops to save
>enemy. For example one cannot execute POW's just because they
>possess a risk to the troops.

This is stupid.  The Americans did not kill POW, although the
Japanese did, and they weren't a risk to the troops.

>I wonder, were the little children in Hiroshima suicidal and
>screaming Banzai? 

My answer to this is I don't know, but I damn well know, the little
children in Nanking weren't screaming Banzai as they were being
slaughtered by Japanese soldiers.  You may be too young to have
seen Japanese news real pictures, which had been passed out around
the world by the Japanese themselves, showed one soldier holding a
small baby aloft on his bayonet.
Perhaps you haven't even seen a photo taken by the Japanese that
showing them beheading of an American airman because he had the
audacity to have bombed Tokyo.

My friend, all of the above is not what I would call disgusting.
It is down right heart breaking.

Erik Shilling



-- 
Erik Shilling		Author; Destiny: A Flying Tiger's 
Flight Leader              Rendezvous With Fate.
3rd Squadron AVG
Flying Tigers

From: cdb100620@aol.com (CDB100620)
Subject: Re: Japanese use of biological agents in China
Date: 01 Jan 1997

Japan's biological warfare outfit was Unit 731, based in the outskirts of
Harbin, Manchuria.  Its cover name was the Epidemic Prevention and Potable
Water Supply Unit.  Lt. Gen Ishii Shiro, MD, commanded the unit.

After the war, the USSR, which captured the unit and its personnel,
published information about its activities.  A number of members of the
unit have written articles and books about the unit's activities.  Unit
731 became a sensation in Japan in 1948 during the American Occupation
when former members masterminded a robbery of the Teikoku Bank involving
the mass murder of bank personnel and customers using potassium cyanide.
The case was cracked by Metropolitan Police Inspector Naruchi Hideo, who
later wrote a book about it.  The Japanese public, which was horrified and
outraged by the brutal callousness of the bank robbers, was further
horrified when the perpetrators were arrested and the details of Unit
731's activities were also revealed.

Unit 731 operations used plague, cholera, typhoid, and gangrene agents.
It developed a defoliation bacilli bomb, a single one of which could
blight vegetation over 50 square kilometers.  A special project code-named
Maruta used human beings for experiments.  Thousands of Chinese and some
allied POWs were confined at a prison compound near Unit 731.  They were
injected with biological agents under laboratory conditions to test the
effects of the bacterial agent.  The Unit also experimented with freezing
and frostbite.  One infamous experiment involved testing the effects of
freezing on the skin of different races of people.
Persons used in experiments were routinely vivisected to observe the
results of the biological agent on them.
After the prisoners used in experiments died, the bodies were burned in a
garbage incinerator.
Some thousands of Chinese captives died when Unit 731 confined them in
target areas where bacteriological bombs were dropped to see how many of
the prisoners would become infected and how many would die in what period
of time.  Any left alive after such bomb tests would be bayoneted and
burned.
Unit 731 infected such objects as chuka manju (a type of bean-paste
sweet), fountain pens and rodents, which they then distributed in Chinese
villages to observe how many people would fall sick and die.  They wanted
to determine the most efficient and most lethal way to introduce
biological agents to an unsuspecting civilian population.
When Soviet forces approached the Unit 731 compound, the Japanese
attempted to destroy all traces of the Unit's activities.  Prisoners were
fed potassium cyanide-laced food.  Those who did not eat were
machine-gunned.  The bodies where thrown into a pit, doused with gasoline
and burned.  Because of the great number of corpses, they did not burn
thoroughly.  The charred bodies were then put into a pulverizer.
Engineers dynamited the buildings and equipment, tools and papers were
burned.  Unit 731 personnel were given the highest priority evacuation
back to Japan by Japanese military authorities.

Gen. Ishii, who returned to Japan, was not arrested by U.S. Occupation
authorities, nor ever charged with war crimes.  This fact brought outrage
in Japan after the Teikoku Bank robbery, because the Tokyo Metropolitan
Police investigation revealed that only Unit 731 personnel knew how to use
potassium cyanide in the way it was used in the robbery.  The Unit's
research on "inferior people" as Ishii described the work, had been turned
against the Japanese themselves--and they were furious.
The Soviet Union did try captured members of Unit 731, and trial records
were published by the USSR Foreign Language Press in the 1950s.

All of this has been thoroughly covered in Japan.  See Akiyama Hiroshi,
"Tokushu Butai Nanasanichi"  ("Special Unit 731"), 1955, or Akiyama
Hiroshi, "Saikinsen wa Junbi Sarete Ita" ("Biological Warfare Was Ready").
 See also Morita Hiroshi, "Teigin Jiken to Saikin Butai" (The Teikoku Bank
Incident and the Biological Warfare Unit"), also published in 1955.

The Japanese also engaged in poison gas experiments on civilian
populations, and the systematic vivisection of B-29 crewmen captured after
their planes were shot down.
Japan's poison gas plant was located at Okunoshima near Hiroshima.  The
gas was used in in fighting in Shanshi Province in China in 1939,
according to Lt. Gen. Hashimoto Mure, and may have been used elsewhere in
China.  Some 350 "mandatory labor service" personnel, mostly mobilized
Japanese students, died at the plant while producing the gas.  See "Nippon
ni Atta Dokugasu To" ("Japan's Poison Gas Island"), 1966 [Anonymous
author].
The vivisection experiments were carried out at Kyushu University medical
school in May and June, 1945.  POWs were obtained from the Western Japan
Military Command.  Prof. Ishiyama Fukujiro, director of external medicine,
led the experiments.  In one experiment, Prof. Ishiyama extracted the
prisoner's lungs and put them in a surgical pan.  He made an incision in
the lung artery and allowed blood to flow into the thorax, killing the
victim.  In another experiment, Prof. Ishiyama first removed a prisoner's
stomach, then cut five ribs out and held a large artery near the heart to
determine how long he could stop the blood flow before the victim died.
In another experiment, Prof. Ishiyama made four openings in a prisoner's
skull and inserted a knife into the skull cavity to see what would happen.
The prisoner died.  The exact number of American airmen experimented on in
this way is not known, but it may have been in the hundreds.  See Senba
Yoshikiyo, "Seitai Kaibo Jiken" ("The Human Vivisection Incident"), 1957.