From: John De Armond
Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.rv-travel
Subject: Re: PolyVinylButyl Tubing
Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2005 01:40:48 -0500
Message-ID: <88bst0pvjp4k3v723uo0vfkj79j2nsuh00@4ax.com>

On Thu, 06 Jan 2005 20:49:51 -0800, Chap <***@*****.***> wrote:

>I ahve the gray stuff (1/2") for my water lines.  It has a copper
>bands securing each fitting.  I need to shorten one line after
>installing my hot water heater bypass.  How do I dela with these
>copper bands?  Is their an alternate way to secure fittings with this
>type tubing?
>
>TIA

You cut the old bands off and crimp on new ones.  Lowe's carries the QEST
line of PEX fittings and tools.  They stock the $100 crimp tool.  there is
a cheaper tool available that they can order.  It looks like a copper
tubing flare block.  I ordered one and the cost was about $35.

Here is lots 'o info on tools and fittings.

http://www.pexconnection.com/bestpex/bestpexcatalog4.htm#Crimp Tool

The one Lowe's ordered for me is similar to item # 18599, second photo.
It takes maybe 5 minutes to make up one joint, much slower than the
regular crimp tool but for putzing around in your own MH that doesn't
matter much.  If you're going to be doing much work you might want to
check into renting a regular crimper.

Do NOT try to substitute something else for the crimp ring.  Like a worm
clamp, for instance.  It won't work.  BTDT.  PEX has a nasty habit of cold
flowing.  You'll think the worm clamp worked, only to have the fitting
blow off after the plastic flows a little, enough to loosen the joint.  A
lot of engineering went in to making this system work.

An alternative might be the QEST line of compression fittings.  Lowe's
stocks these too.  They're big and bulky and a PITA to work with but they
don't require any special tools.

John

From: John De Armond
Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.rv-travel
Subject: Re: RV plumbing - was Dutchmen
Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2006 00:57:41 -0500
Message-ID: <4oin02dkupmskr1vhthrnl00jt517cmf9r@4ax.com>

On Sun, 05 Mar 2006 09:28:15 -0600, "R.J.(Bob) Evans" <bob d0t evans
at sasktel d0t net> wrote:

>On Sun, 05 Mar 2006 13:47:31 GMT Will Sill <will@epix.enet> wrote:
>
>>> Apparently it's called progress - personally I still
>>>like copper but the last time we had some plumbing done in the house
>>>they used plastic pipe and it appears to be working.
>>
>>Having used both, I would never again install copper.  Plastic is MUCH
>>easier to work with.  There are of course pros and cons: I'm stating a
>>preference.
>
>I agree with you that it is easier to work with but:
>1) who said plumbing was supposed to be easy?

I thought all it had to do was carry water and not leak.

>2) would you rather have "plastic" pipes or "copper" pipes?  Copper
>just sounds better to me.  And looks better too.

In an RV?  Plastic.  At least PEX plastic.  Easy to install, ligher
weight, non-corrosive (put some eastern PA water in your rig and see
why this is important) and if I screw up and let it freeze, no damage
done.

Actually, after working with PEX for awhile, it has bubbled to the
top of my list for plumbing anywhere.  I had the tap water eat through
the copper plumbing in my apartment building in Royalton, PA.  The
CPVC plumbing I (mistakenly) installed in my restaurant has been
turned to glass by the 180 deg hot water.  The part of my building
that still has galvanized plumbing pukes rust for the first few
seconds, eats up toilet and faucet valves and leaves orange streaks
everywhere.

PEX is the closest thing there is to being able to string plumbing
like wiring.  It's strong, hot water resistant, resistant to just
about anything that will show up in tap water, easy to work with, fast
to work with, relatively inexpensive and never adds any taste to the
water.

PEX can be installed to whatever degree of craftsmanship the customer
is willing to pay for.  Perfectly straight runs, exact 90 deg bends
and so on are easy but time consuming to do.  For myself, I don't
bother.

>
>There's an element of craftsmanship to copper plumbing that is going
>to disappear.

What craftsmanship is involved in sticking a hunk of tubing in a
compression fitting and turning the nut?  Or with sweated fittings,
that big scorch mark most plumbers leave behind on the wood because
they're too lazy or in too much of a hurry to use a heat baffle?

>
>FTR - I don't like chipboard either.  Not even when it is called OSB.

Boy, I do, at least when it's used correctly.  My opinion changed a
couple of years ago when I fished out some furniture from my
un-climate-controlled mini-warehouse where it had been stored for
about 8 years.  There was the all-wood oak dresser I had as a kid and
a Drexel (high end mfr) home entertainment center made of cherry
laminated OSB.  No OSB is visible anywhere including the back.

The dresser had practically come apart from the heat of summer and the
humidity of winter.  Most of the glued joints had failed and the
bottoms had fallen out of all the drawers.  The Drexel sitting almost
beside it was in perfect condition.  As were the matching Drexel end
tables.

My only complaint with the home entertainment center is that it takes
4 apes and a crane to move it.  That OSB is HEAVY.

John