From: Steven B. Harris <sbharris@ix.netcom.com>
Newsgroups: sci.med.nutrition
Subject: Re: Selenium arsenic balance &c (Was: Re: amalgam-mercury 
	poisening)
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 02:24:10 GMT

In article <3530F074.57D2@erols.com>,
	physical@erols.com wrote:

>	I have read claims that the vapor pressure of Hg can actually be
>measured in the mouth!  If this is true, I will allow my wife to be
>alone with Clinton for a full half hour!  In round numbers, the vp @ 30
>deg C is 30 for water, .003 for Hg, and about 1/50 of that for silver.
>Surely in an amalgam, the vp would be closer to that of silver.
>	It would seem, though, that fillings _are_ a long term and releasable
>repository of Hg.  The question is, what are the molar amounts <get
>it--  MOLAR!! huyuk!!>, and what amounts are subclinically toxic to the
>body.  Given that fillings do not seem to dissolve out of the tooth, at
>least not for a cupla hundred years, one could calculate a worst-case
>scenario for this release.

 You can and it's been done.  Amalgam fillings do contribute to the body's
burdon of mercury, and this can be measured.  The only problem is that the
contribution is of the same order as random environmental stuff like how
much fish you eat (even the best you can find), and whether or not you're
around mercury containing paints (outlawed only in 1986-7), etc.  And last
but not least is the levels of mercury in people with scads of fillings are
WAY less (like 1%) than the levels permitted in industrial situations, which in
turn are based on lots of toxicology with animals, and lots of experience
with known mercury poisoning in humans.  So it's hard to get excited about
amalgam fillings.  If they're doing everything they're supposed to be doing,
how come people who have 100 times more mercury in them from exposure on
the job, aren't all basket cases?  Eh?   Answer me that, oh anxious ones.
And how come all these people who claim to be poisoned by their fillings
don't have any of the classic chronic poisoning symptoms, like acrodynia?


>	It is the vapor of mercury and its ionic form that are particularly
>dangerous, as well as the methyl/alkyl forms.  The merck says you can
>"occasionally" swallow Hg with no ill effects.  Tonic, anyone?  Of
>course, various mercury compounds have been used medicinally (tinctures,
>cathartics, emetics) for some time.

    Basically, your body has the power to turn mercury vapor and mercury
organics, into ionic-form mercury (the salt), if the load isn't too large.
And ionic mercury doesn't get into the CNS too well.  That means in practice
that all those CNS effects of mercury you read of are either organic mercury
poisonings, or massive mercury vapor inhalations (mercury as the metal vapor
does cross into the CNS, if enough is given to overload the body's oxidation
system).  Fortunately, not much metallic mercury is absorbed from single
ingestions (somebody swallows a few drops from a thermometer, say).  Mercury
salts, and small long term exposure to vapor (fillings) would NOT be expected
to cause problems in the brain or nervous system.  It doesn't happen that way
in animals, and it doesn't make sense from what we know about mercury.  But
that is exactly what the amalgam screamer people are claiming is happening.

   If they were all having renal problems and finger pain (ionic mercury
tox symptoms), I'd find it all a *little* less preposterous, since
anything they breathe from fillings is ALL going to get converted to
ionic form, as the doses are so tiny.  As it is, all the amalgam filling
symptoms sound suspiciously like the symptoms of chronic fluoride and
aspartame poisoning. And gulf war syndrome.  And Xanax withdrawal.  And
all the symptoms you see in the placebo group of every drug experiment in
the PDR.  I should post all of these in several columns some time.

                                      Steve Harris, M.D.

From: sbharris@ix.netcom.com(Steven B. Harris)
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative,sci.med.nutrition,misc.kids.health,
	sci.med.dentistry
Subject: Re: chronic fluoride poisoning
Date: 4 Oct 1998 00:56:31 GMT

In <6v61v9$2f0$1@birch.prod.itd.earthlink.net> joele@earthlink.net
(Joel M. Eichen) writes:

>"Hans Lennros" <hans.lennros@swipnet.se> wrote:
>
>>Hi Joel
>
>>You wrote:
>
>>>Hg is not a drug with a therapeutic effect, hence no LD50.
>>>You missed the point of my, "Right! You did not
>>>understand the "tone" of it."
>
>>Two times wrong!
>
>>1. To determine LD50 of something there is no need it must
>>    have a terapeutic effect.
>
>>2. Hg has a terapeutic effect. Not long ago it was used in
>>    medicine (and still are in some countries).
>
>Mercurochrome!



  That must be the last holdout, along with mercury thermometers and
manometers, which are still used in medicine.

   A few years ago there were mercurial diuretics, now gone.  Before
that, mercury cathartics and (of course) anti-syphilitics.  "One night
with Venus, one year with Mercury," as the saying went.  Turn Oscar
Wilde's teeth black (though in his case it would have been Ganymede
rather than Venus).

                                   Steve Harris, M.D.

From: sbharris@ix.netcom.com(Steven B. Harris)
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative,sci.med.nutrition,misc.kids.health,
	sci.med.dentistry
Subject: Re: chronic fluoride poisoning
Date: 4 Oct 1998 01:00:15 GMT

In <hRvR1.2514$yM.2676901@nntpserver.swip.net> "Hans Lennros"
<hans.lennros@swipnet.se> writes:

>Hi Joel
>
>You wrote:
>>This is getting a little silly isn't it?
>
>In one way: yes. In antoher way no. Why not?
>
>I am sure you have a good control of drugs you need
>to prescribe and all that. Or you can easily look up its
>potential toxicity, etc.
>
>I am also sure you can advice the upset mother who calls
>your office needing urgent advice on what to do when her
>four year child has been eating up all of the fluor tablets
>that was in the box. But what if the child has broken an old
>Hg-thermometer. Do you say: don't know?


   No, you say: don't worry about it.  Swallowed metallic mercury is
not a big deal.  The old NG tubes used to have a little bag of mercury
on the end, and now and again one would break.  The mercury passes.

   Inhaled mercury is much nastier, as it gets oxidized in the lungs.
And soluble mercury salts (Hg2+) in general (see the Mad Hatter).
Organic mercury (methyl mercury) is nastiest of all, of course.  Last
year a leading mercury researcher got one drop of the stuff on a bare
hand, and eventually DIED from it.

                                       Steve Harris, M.D.

From: sbharris@ix.netcom.com(Steven B. Harris)
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative,sci.med.nutrition,misc.kids.health,
	sci.med.dentistry
Subject: Re: Hg(CH3)2 (was Re: chronic fluoride poisoning)
Date: 4 Oct 1998 03:49:00 GMT

In <6v6pot$eoo$1@clarknet.clark.net> kfl@clark.net (Keith Lynch)
writes:
>
>In article <6v6hav$shd@sjx-ixn5.ix.netcom.com>,
>Steven B. Harris <sbharris@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>> Organic mercury (methyl mercury) is nastiest of all, of course.
>> Last year a leading mercury researcher got one drop of the stuff
>> on a bare hand, and eventually DIED from it.
>
>No, it's even worse than that.  She got one drop on a GLOVED hand,
>and died from it.  Despite aggressive treatment.


  Now that you mention it, I guess I did read that.  But didn't believe
it.  Must've had a tear in that glove.

From: Steven B. Harris <sbharris@ix.netcom.com>
Newsgroups: sci.med.nutrition
Subject: Re: Hg(CH3)2 (was Re: chronic fluoride poisoning)
Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 02:57:51 GMT

In article <6v892o$s43$1@strato.ultra.net>,
	wright@nospam.clam (David Wright) wrote:

>In article <6v6r7c$7ao@sjx-ixn4.ix.netcom.com>,
>Steven B. Harris <sbharris@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>In <6v6pot$eoo$1@clarknet.clark.net> kfl@clark.net (Keith Lynch)
>>writes:
>>>
>>>In article <6v6hav$shd@sjx-ixn5.ix.netcom.com>,
>>>Steven B. Harris <sbharris@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>>> Organic mercury (methyl mercury) is nastiest of all, of course.
>>>> Last year a leading mercury researcher got one drop of the stuff
>>>> on a bare hand, and eventually DIED from it.
>>>
>>>No, it's even worse than that.  She got one drop on a GLOVED hand,
>>>and died from it.  Despite aggressive treatment.
>>
>>  Now that you mention it, I guess I did read that.  But didn't believe
>>it.  Must've had a tear in that glove.
>
>Nope.  No visible holes in the glove, which was latex.  The stuff went
>right through it, and her skin, and it killed her.  One drop.  If
>she'd gone straight to the hospital right after it happened, she might
>have lived, but it was months before symptoms set in, and chelation
>didn't work.
>
>Her name was Karen Wetterhahn, and she was a professor in the
>chemistry department at Dartmouth College, my alma mater.  I have a
>copy of the 4/98 alumni magazine next to me -- the cover story was
>about her.
>
>  -- David Wright :: wright at ibnets.com :: Not a Spokesman for Anyone
>     These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
>     While the unexamined life may not be worth living, the over-
>     examined life is not being lived.
>



Thanks for the correction.  Well, remind me to use neoprene gloves when
next I handle methyl mercury.